@lizzie

You wanna hear something wild I just realized?

At the last supper, when Jesus breaks the bread and calls it his flesh...

In Hebrew, the word for bread is the same as the Aramaic and Arabic word for Meat: Lahm.

And then the Koine Greek word for wine also means Blood.

It's an easter egg.

@lizzie

It may also be an allegory. Saying you need both the semetic bread/meat and the european wine/blood. As in, the church and the scripture must both be united.

@lizzie

you can't have the eastern church and western church any more than you can remove the blood from the body or eat bread without something to drink. Nor does discarding a portion of the scripture benefit the church. It's a unity rather than a uniformity.

@lizzie

And if it is an allegory, heretofore unnoticed, it would also be a prophesy since the east-west schism didn't happen until the 4th century, and that was around the time the first canon was put together. Meaning... That the people at the time would not have understood the significance.

@technicallydifficult usually when people say east-west schism they mean the schism between what would become the roman catholic church and the eastern orthodox church which happened much later. greece is the east in thus scheme. i think youre talking about the schisms over christology

@technicallydifficult actually 4th century isnt that when nicaea happened

@lizzie

oh yeah, but also right after east and western empire split. Constantine fought against the other claimants to the imperial throne. During the war, he became a christian. As did his mother Catherine and his wife Helen. All 3 were canonized as Orthodox saints.

@technicallydifficult i mean he isnt considered a saint in the western churches but thats not be the church was in schism anywhere near that point in time

@lizzie I'm talking about the semitic vs european split. Whatever precipitated it, it was messy. And it includes 2 heretical extremes: marcionism and islam. One denying the Sacrifice of Christ and the other denying all semitic content as evil. But the Semitic languages bear in their words certain nuances, which are lost on greeks and romans. Namely that justice is not punishment, but a re-balancing of scales. Sola Semetica (Islam) vs Sola Europa (marcionites) are extremes among the heresies. But also illustrative of the issue.

@technicallydifficult ahhhhhh i see what you mean. yeah the apostles are very clear on christianity as union of the two groups and not just one or the other

@technicallydifficult plus a lot of the cause for schism with the miaphysites (and the nestorians imo) is bc roman christianity had aligned itself so thoroughly with the empire that just leaving those outside of it out of discussions was considered fine

@lizzie

The Sunni Shia split is really interesting if you start comparing their practices and attitudes to regional christian denominations. The Shia are very similer to Orthodox Christians of several types, while Sunni are similar to Nestorians and Arians. It is really clear to me now that it began as a christian heresy. And St John of Damascus thought this was the case as well.

@lizzie

Muhammad's clan was called Banu Hashem. His grandfather Abdul Muttalib was a "monotheist". Hashem is the hebrew euphemism for God, meaning "The Name". Banu Hashem means Clan of the Name. The Banu Hashem were caretakers of the Kaaba. And they were (at least the leadership) monotheists. In the story of The Year of the Elephant, God protected the Kaaba with miracles from an Ethiopian and Yemeni Christian Army. Why would God protect a pagan temple from christians, and why would monotheists guard a pagan temple? I highly suspect this story is about rival churches rather than monotheist vs pagan.

@lizzie

and if that is true, then I suspect the smashing of "idols" was actually destruction of saint icons.

@lizzie

lol, maybe this is why they tell converts not to bother learning the seerah...

@lizzie

Which, would mean that Paul visiting Arabia is when they would have likely become acquainted with Christianity, though they already had Jews... Speaking of which: (check captions)

@lizzie

It is also worthy of note that different types of christians from all over christendom went to the egyptian and arabian deserts to be hermit-monks. 5 types of christians are mentioned in seerah literature: copts, arians, nestorians, ethiopian orthodox, nestorians, and arab orthodox. One of the enslaved concubines of muhammad was a Coptic Nun named Maria. While Khadija's uncle who proclaimed Muhammad's prophethood was an Arian hermit.

@technicallydifficult @lizzie seems kind of fucked up to force a nun to be a concubine

@alienskyler @lizzie

it is.

@lizzie @technicallydifficult *still* kicking myself over not leaving the church when i first learned about that particular controversy

@apophis @lizzie

Join the Lutheransssssss....

@apophis @technicallydifficult one thing i love about anglicanism is that we have absolutely no problems with being in full communion with miaphysites so we’re chill with the mar thoma church (oriental (miaphysite) protestants derived from the malankara church)

unfortunately anglicanism isnt free from sin in this case either bc the history of the mar thoma church is a lot of suffering under british colonialism

@technicallydifficult @apophis tbh i love lutheranism and am happy to go to a lutheran church tomorrow oh thats today i should sleep but i do not think a suggestion that apophis join a christian denomination is going to go over well 😭

@lizzie @apophis

I watched a bunch of educational videos for "before your first visit" type thing. Me likey.

@lizzie @apophis

They're legit based.

@technicallydifficult @apophis oh yeah i love lutheranism. even as an anglican ive been kinda crypto-lutheran about it lmao

church im at is doing an adult class on the small catechism which is interesting. i was kinda worried when i saw the emphasis on the 10 commandments but the explanations of them in the catechism are actually really good. its very centered on loving God and your neighbor, and like “thou shalt not steal” is considered more focused on how we should be seeking the benefit of our neighbors rather than treating property as a fundamental reality

@lizzie @apophis

*Random viking enters the chat* "it's not stealing if they're dead first"